Big Digital Energy

0:00 We're in the studio. It's me, Mark, and Kurt today, uh, Chuck's out at lunch. So no politics today. No politics today, uh, countries in focus election year, 2024. So we had a busy week this

0:14 week. We had our empower conference, which was really good. No, break it down for us, bro. Yeah, I think, I think, you know, kind of my takeaways from it or one, the sentiment around, you

0:26 know, let's bifurcate it between Bitcoin mining and high performance computing, like AI, there are a lot of EMPs there. You know, got like one of my guys that's invested in DW came, you know,

0:37 he's got 6 million cubic feet of gas per day. He's like, man, I'm getting negative 70 cents per MCF. He's like, I'm looking for alternatives. And he said that he got so much information from

0:50 Empower. He's like, you know, I'm looking at this new asset that I'm developing. And he's like, this opens up my mind to how I should look at that asset And really, you know, I might be able to

1:01 extract value out of it. And so just a sentiment around EMPs, like actually looking at Bitcoin mining as a legitimate infrastructure play. You're starting to see the

1:11 tide turn there. And then lots of the Bitcoin miners talking about AI. It's interesting to hear what's happening in the AI space. And give us sort of sum it up for us. What do you think they're

1:23 thinking about? What is happening when you see the next few years? So what do you see all of the public Bitcoin miners getting into the AI space? And I think that it makes sense for them. They got

1:33 large infrastructure, these large on grid mines that have large power purchase agreements. And so it makes sense for them to have these GPU clusters out there. But they'd have to rip out some of

1:42 their mining. That's the problem is that, yeah. Like the computers that you use for Bitcoin mining are ASICs and they're specifically for Bitcoin mining. And so it's not like you can use that

1:53 equipment, but you can use the infrastructure and the electricity, right? And so, you know, I don't think that. I don't think that this will be a model for like small independent oil and gas

2:05 producers to run, you know, GPUs and Bitcoin miners simultaneously, but it'll be, it'll be interesting to see what some of these larger, larger players do because I do think that they'll have

2:18 some optionality and doing both of them I mean, I do think, I mean, this is interesting. Bitcoin was sort of that, that's the, the one, you know, purpose for stranded energy that's being

2:30 wasted. Like, let's, let's run some Bitcoin mining. But what's interesting is we've talked about AI so much. Yeah. Strand, like, AI is dying for more capacity. Yeah. Why not put capacity out?

2:43 Yeah. Energy super cheap. I think what we're going to have to dive into. I was talking to someone on Twitter about this the other day was the thing about Bitcoin mining is that it's extremely

2:53 flexible and and dispatchable load. I mean, you can, you can turn off the miners on, on a. seconds notice on AI. But as a minor, you don't want to be turned off 'cause you're losing money. No,

3:07 not necessarily because if you participate in the

3:11 ArtCOD Insillery program, they pay you for that. And so there's actually, it's a good, it's pretty lucrative to actually shut off. But what we need to dive into further, and I was talking to

3:23 someone on Twitter about the other day that's a machine learning expert is what GPUs be able to be flexible on that level as well, like will someone want their GPU clusters turning off while a

3:35 model's being trained? Or is there flexibility to switch to other GPU clusters? And so I think that remains to be unseen. Why don't I get some experts in here sometime to kind of walk us through

3:47 that, but you know, well, these GPU clusters. It's interesting 'cause I just got pitched this morning 'cause I always take these business, like people looking for cat money, there's this team

3:55 out of Dublin, they're Italians that have developed a platform to basically redistribute load to multiple sources. So let's say that I'm primarily running off, you know, Amazon's, you know, data

4:11 cluster, but I can find cheaper. It's really cool that technology is people are really designing new applications and new ideas to basically service this capability of having flexible loads. And

4:27 it's redundancy with the cloud computing too, right? Like the way I think about it is I kind of have this vision. I don't know if we'll ever get here, but you know what we're doing with our

4:36 language models on on collide. It's like, man, it'd be awesome if someday if we ever had our own foundational model. And I have a bunch of H100 GPUs fired up off of net gas. Like off grid, I'm

4:46 not dependent on Azure and AWS. And but it's like even, you know, doing that, it's like, okay, you can have on-prem servers, but then you have redundancy if on-prem goes down, back up on AWS

5:03 and that's all managed by software, right? So that's, yeah, it is kind of cool. I think what's also cool is like the inflection point of like hardware is becoming cool again and like hardware and

5:13 software and so. So what is the summary of Empower What? did you learn this year? And what is sort of the future of Empower? Let's, I want to get those takes. Yeah, you know, I actually didn't

5:28 even want to do Empower moving forward, like it's such a big lift for DW. Like from an operation. Dude, event is stock, bro. It takes a lot of work, man. And it's super stressful. And within

5:39 an hour of Empower going, I sent a message to our team. I said, Hey, we have to keep doing Empower. Like I saw how important it is for the people that were there. And also if you look at just

5:49 where we're in the curve of high performance computing, I mean, we've been doing Empower for three years. It's like we're early in the game. And this only is going to continue to grow big names.

5:59 Speaking of early. One example that I think is encouraging for the smaller kind of old school producers and thinking about creative ways, you had Amalgamated Sludge there, Dan Worson, he's been

6:11 doing this on his own in New Mexico. I met him years ago,

6:20 was running some assets at Exxon, but he's doing it in New Mexico, he's got optionality built in to his operation where he's mining at a fairly small scale, but he also has optionality from his gas

6:36 production, he's got a gas plan on site. He's got an interconnect close by, and I think he's been out in front of this. In fact, he characterized it, I think in one comment I

6:46 heard that

6:49 this is

6:51 the industry, the EP industry's awareness of what is possible here Reminds him of, you know, Wolf Camp horizontal. from 2010, 2011. 100. Yeah. So I think

7:06 the hub or the network or the platform of empower is important early in this. What's coming, I think.

7:15 I agree. I think what was cool about this year is that we had a lot more, I'd say meet on the bone in terms of like presentations. Like I'm looking at this presentation

7:24 from 360 mining. And you can go find this, I posted the slide in collide So if you go to collide, go to my profile, you can see it. I need to go post the entire presentation 'cause this is only

7:34 one slide. So it doesn't have the sensitivities, but it's comparing traditional midstream connection to Bitcoin mining. And so with the pipeline, CapEx to access the market, it's 500, 000

7:47 Bitcoin mining, you're looking at 2 million. So there's a lot more in CapEx for Bitcoin mining with your generators and computers, things of that nature. But traditional midstream, you're getting

7:57 a buck 50 per MCF. Bitcoin mining, you're getting20 from CF.

8:04 You know, goes through the realized gas price. You know, after all your fees and midstream, you're realizing a dollar per MCF, Bitcoin mining, you're realizing18,

8:13 and then realized profit per MCF, and the midstream is0. And

8:18 Bitcoin mining is17. Well, obviously lots of variables and sensitivities. Is that why pro give me that data? It's in, it's in. Now it's in, it's in. It's in, it's in, it's in Oh, hello?

8:29 You had the, you had

8:33 the chip installed. Yeah, I'm on Neuralink. I got a Clyde Pro on Neuralink. Dude, speaking of Neuralink, interesting you said

8:38 that, but the, a guy that, first human patient of Neuralink, which is Elon Musk Brain Computer Company, said he used the wireless implant to stay up all night playing Civilization 6. Yeah, we

8:52 talked about this. We talked about this on BDE week's last.

8:57 I think it's extremely based that the first use case of Neuralink is staying up all night playing game games. Yeah, I love it. Makes so much sense. It's so true. Who thinks first of mine?

9:09 It's kind of like bringing that back to Bitcoin. It's like the first, like some of the richest people off of Bitcoin were all poker players, online poker players. Really? Yeah, because they

9:18 needed a medium to be able to transact. Honestly, use Bitcoin. And so when you look at like early adopters of these technologies, it's usually gamers and really just kind of people that are

9:30 digitally. I mean, I was reading like, you know, Blink, Sam Altman's world coin hit another roadblock after Portuguese authorities ordered it to stop collecting proof of personhood. The

9:41 eye-scanning orb and token of forced growing opposition to over privacy concerns. I mean, sort of flying in the face of what Bitcoin is all about. Yeah, for sure. World coin is weird. I did not.

9:52 It's a strange thing I actually thought that was like a scam the first time. Isn't it a scam? I mean, you have a chip in you, can it charge you? I think Neuralink's cool as shit, and I think

10:00 that it's the next step of evolution for humans. Where are you gonna put it? Ultimately, where am I gonna put mine? Where does it go? It goes in your brain. But where in your brain? I don't

10:09 think you have an optionality to like, where to put it. No, no, no, no, no, but right back. Do you get right to show what I got? Yeah, which, you know, which, you know, low up and low up

10:17 and low up. You have some kind of switch you could be creative, then you can be. Yeah, that's right What I mean, really like this is, you know, you think about the rise of AI and I mean, like,

10:25 there is a case that AI could destroy you some day. Listen to the rug in Elon from Halloween last year. I need to, I haven't listened to that yet. So, anyways, we have a lot that we talked about

10:36 on Neuralink and also the rights of humanoid robots and like energy consumption. We need to go do a deep dive episode on all of this time. Love that, Scott, come in. But anyways, Mark, we got

10:46 our numbers guy back today, Mark and so What the hell happened in the energy markets? I just thought we'd hit a little. crude oil update since you pointed out it was fairly light across the board,

10:60 but for energy news. But, you know, one thing that caught my eye is that March demand for Asia was particularly strong relative to January, February. In fact, I think combined China and India

11:15 were up over a million barrels a day versus January. And then when you couple that with what the EIA short-term outlook is saying and what has happened recently in the Ukraine-Russia conflict with

11:30 Ukraine through its drone strikes taking off about a million barrels a day of Russian refining capacity. I think you have some scramble out there in the market for refined product imports and crude

11:42 oil imports into Asia. And there's another blur about there today that the Saudis are raising their official selling price by 20 cents into Asia for August. Yeah, I saw that. What's your read?

11:56 Well, I think the combination of

12:00 tighter supply and some early green shoots, particularly related to Chinese industrial related demand.

12:09 And if you look at the US, which grew last year, 2023, way more than I think early expectations coming into the year where the EIA has 400, 000 barrels a day of growth versus over a million last

12:25 year for US oil production, they keep that growth number flat in 2025. So 400, 000 barrels a day growth this year, 400, 000 barrels a day next year. And the reason they're not more aggressive is

12:41 they see a slight decline in their, they use a scenario based price forecast or price prediction price deck. And so they see declining, slightly declining or it count, but. that's somewhat offset

12:56 by improved per well productivity, something we've talked about with, which has been a theme in the consolidation transactions that we've seen here recently. So in part of this, just real quick,

13:09 there's about 800, 000 barrels a day of refining capacity that comes offline. I believe mostly in India for seasonal maintenance. Really? Okay I don't see anything about the EIA's oil production,

13:25 oil inventory. Josh Young was talking to me about it at the Houston Open a couple of days ago. He said there was some discrepancy in numbers. And I'm butchering this right now. I should have came

13:37 more prepared. I should have looked it up. I was just curious if you saw anything on that. I did, and I did look at what they're projecting for, what the EIA is projecting for stock draws for the

13:48 quarterly over the year. And there's a pretty strong, I think approaching high. several hundred thousand barrels a day in the first quarter. Oh, and one other piece that was in there, at least

14:01 in the Reuters piece, was

14:05 Nigeria and Iraq are particularly notable since they came in light with their production. That's in addition to the voluntary OPEC cuts that will remain in place until the end of June at least. So

14:18 what's this? What does all of this mean in the short term for you? Well, I think

14:27 there's always the political risk of what we've talked about as well, this being a US. presidential election year. That's what I'm saying. We have a lot. Arm twisting. You've got two and a half

14:37 million barrels a day offline on paper as it relates to those cuts. You're going to look out into the third and fourth quarter of 2024 and suggest that you're going to have a high confidence that

14:50 some of that doesn't start to leak. I mean, crude. I just looked at it. knocking on 84. Yeah, we're at 80 TI. 84 right now, that's what I'm curious is like coming into election season. Yeah,

15:02 what's your prediction? What do you think is gonna happen? I just think there's some unquantifiable risk out there that we're gonna see some pressures to get. I mean, I paid4 a gallon for the

15:14 first time in a long time. That's what I was just curious about 'cause like I don't hear anyone like really talking about gas prices right now or anything. So it seems like public sentiment is

15:23 decent Where commodity prices are, so, you know, does the Biden administration look at it and say, Oh, we need to get gas prices down going into. I mean, that's a lever that actually makes a

15:35 difference. So absolutely, especially with all the diesel, as diesel prices, I mean, that's sort of how the country runs, right? Yeah. Certainly don't have the SPR lever. Right. Yeah, kind

15:45 of exhaust or what, right? Yeah, that's true. Yeah, so it's like, what levers do you have to pull as the other industry? I just think there's, you know,

15:54 level of elevated political risk to the downside from here. And as we, it becomes more of a headline issue. Yeah. And something that's going to be much more hotly debated. I think if this

16:09 tightness continues to persist and we see pretty significant inventory draws going into going into the summer.

16:17 And we have things like supply chain disruptions, although it's not

16:23 significantly related to crude products, but you had the, you know, the bridge tragedy last week. Yeah. And moving things around, as we know, can cause some,

16:35 some upset in the market as well. Yeah. It'd be interesting to know, you know, what kind of butterfly effect that has for shipping and transport logistics with that bridge going down. This whole

16:47 report that said that it was going to take 10 years to rebuild that was just fucking insane. You're kidding me. Ten years. I just don't get me wrong. Big bridge, but. Or wouldn't you like to be

16:55 the construction company? Yeah, the construction company wins that bill. It's just kind of embarrassing how it takes to - I saw a piece on describing exactly when it was Kudos to the Harbor pilot

17:09 who was on the bridge. And he could have done a number of things, but critically with all the power loss, he pulled out his cell phone and called the authorities And that was - if he'd have waited

17:26 60 to 90 seconds longer, he wouldn't have been able to get relay the communication they need to shut down the bridge. Really? Yeah, and it could have been a lot worse. I saw the first saw of

17:36 the video. When I first saw the video, I noticed that there was no traffic on it at the beginning. It didn't resonate with me as I watched the video the first time that they were able to shut the

17:48 bridge down, because I was just like, man, that's so lucky that there was no traffic on there Apparently the quick link. Pretty heroic. The quick thinking to use a cell phone because of other

17:58 electronics and coms being down or sporadic. And there were, you know, there's a checklist of things you go through on board. And you said, the most important thing is to get word to shut down

18:08 the bridge. And that was a split second decision, probably saved a lot of lives. Yeah. Good on them.

18:14 So speaking of political and oil and gas risk, we had the president of Guyana on BBC news Yeah. This has been circulating. It's good. It's been circulating. And I'm like, this dude's my hero.

18:28 Like, we need to get him on BD some time because this guy just absolutely goes off. Mark, you want to kind of lay out the lay of the land for anyone that didn't see this? Yeah, it was an

18:39 interview. And if you haven't seen it, then we'll put a link to the video we got to. You don't know what the internet is But

18:47 so it was a sit down interview with Erfan Ali, BBC reporter Steven Sakura.

18:55 who starts the interview offer at least this clip, I haven't seen the full interview. I don't know if it shut down after this exchange, but basically saying that Guyana is going to generate150

19:08 billion worth of

19:13 crude oil and I guess secondarily natural gas, but that also translates

19:21 to in their estimate, BBC's estimate, of 2 billion tons of carbon emissions and then he further gets more aggressive by pointing the finger and saying what gives you the right to essentially pollute

19:35 like this, the tradeoff between massive

19:40 economic and prosperity and flexion for a historically poor country in the global south, right? I think he, I think one of those BBC reporter just absolutely screwed up what was. what gives you

19:55 the right and boom. So the substance of the tone was great, the tension was fantastic, it was great entertainment, but really the substance of

20:10 President Ali's rebuttal and counter-lecture is what it turned into was look, we have done as a country a great job of maintaining our biodiversity In the last 50 years where the world has seen his

20:28 estimate of a 60 reduction over the last 50 years and or an increase in deforestation. And against that 2 billion tons of greenhouse gas emissions that the BBC reporter said would come from that150

20:45 billion worth of prosperity for Guyana, the

20:50 carbon sink in Guyana's forest estimated at 19 and a half gigatons. amazing. So somebody else's turn to provide the carbon sink for which he points out they've not been paid. He called out what it

21:04 is, Western hypocrisy, which we talk about this on the show all the time. I mean, clearly he was re-game ready though with this data too. No, he came. Yeah, maybe it's always like he just

21:13 knows it, but that was. You might just know it because obviously he's very passionate about it. And also this dude just embarrasses the presidents that we've had as late young guy in his 40s and

21:23 just very articulate, prepared with facts and has the backbone to stand up for what he believes in. But this Western hypocrisy is what we've talked about on this

21:34 show for years now. And he's saying, you guys, the UK has decreased biodiversity, led deforestation in the industrial age. And now you're telling us that we can't extract resources in our own

21:52 country. Yeah, and you're putting up all these. you know, wind farms, solar farms, which I mean, I think people in general are fans of maybe, maybe not. Yeah. But they're knocking down their

22:06 diversity. They're actually hurting the nature that is the beautiful landscape of the UK to put up all these man-made things. And then they're judging these several countries. And it's actually

22:21 quite interesting, the fact that Guyana has actually preserved these, you know, what was the size of the acreage that they've actually. A size of the UK, or size of England and Scotland combined.

22:32 Combined, combined. The

22:36 area of England and Scotland. They've preserved forest land just for the quarter. That's where the 60 deforestation context is. It's not globally, it's. Just quick Google search is that Guyana's

22:47 forest size is 18 and a half million I thought it was 18 million. Hectors.

22:54 So I mean, it's one, but that's one conversion I never have on. Yeah,

23:00 the what's interesting about this, though, is I'd love to go look at Ghana's imports and exports, because typically countries like this, I mean, are chopping down their forest and using the

23:14 resource, right? And so the fact that they've maintained this and this is point of like, it's like, y'all don't pay us for that. This

23:24 dude is attacking the heart of the entire conversation of not only is there, you know, you want to put a price on carbon, you want to put a price on carbon, then we have this for us and you pay us

23:38 for it. The world pays this for it. Yeah, there's not only is UK deforestation and a issue at issue, but if you

23:46 recall a few weeks ago, we talked about kind of the wood pellet alternative accounting and The story

23:57 was from, or was about a clear cutting of a Canadian old growth forest and getting credits for replacing that harvested very mature carbon sink with new trees, which I'm not a

24:14 biochemist, but replacing the carbon sink capacity of old growth forest has got to be a centuries in the making from new growth to full mature. I mean, that's one of the biggest challenges of

24:27 looking at all these sort of carbon deals and is unlike gold, diamonds, currency, which there's agreement amongst valuation, it's really hard to say that the carbon credits coming off this area is

24:46 worth this. And it's really hard to value that It's really hard to value, like, what kind of trees were it, what, what's happened. You have to really understand the terroir and what's been

24:56 happening there to even think about it. And there's no sort of constancy around the world to zero standards, but can we come to

25:08 agreement on what it's worth in many cases and what it does zero quantification. Absolutely. Like what is guy in 18 million hectares of forest worth as a carbon sink as a carbon sink or or what is

25:23 that worth in an energy crunch to Europeans who need to burn wood pellets. Would you rather us harvest an export? Our forest in Guyana for use and converted power generation. The only one that's

25:38 worth the Ireland that's shutting down their refinery and saying no

25:44 to the LNG import facility That's the only thing that could have been added to the salt in the wound. on this on this interview was if he'd turn around on the BBC guys like, what gives you the right

25:58 to cut down force in the United States, take that carbon sink and burn it and release that CO2 like just the, that BBC reporter obviously came in and it was just not prepared to fire what he was

26:10 about to get served in. I love it. Well, I have another characterization that I'll keep to myself, but why not? This is a podcast. We can say whatever we want. Is it something like I, you know,

26:20 something against people in the UK? You know, it was just, it was just a, it was just a, Chuck's GF might be obsessed to be here. I found it to be. But she likes Mark. I know. She thinks, I

26:30 just think. I would like to mark out. She's like, is Mark going to be there? Mark keeps trying to like, give a point and we're just, I can talk and we'll get on to the next talk. All right.

26:38 What's your point, Mark? It, you know, I think you use the term condescending. I just think there was a kind of a palpable arrogance and a hundred percent in opening

26:52 and really what the issue is on the ground. And not only Guyana, but others that have vast, natural resource, potential and wealth. Right. And

27:03 what it means for those countries that are

27:09 democratically governed and the prosperity and the explosive growth in GDP that this is going to create for Guyana I think also is a little bit disrespectful. Do you think that BBC reporter would

27:25 interrupt Joe Biden or Putin or any other president with that like heads of state? There used to be sort of a unwritten rule of respect. Yeah. But that was in some ways when you watch the videos

27:42 almost attacking what gives you the right. And he's almost saying it's like, oh, because it's a third world country. That's what I'm saying Yes, that's what I'm getting at is that it just seemed

27:51 very dished disrespectful that you're below us. And I just think it comes back to it's like, look, you have Guyana, which is a developing nation, and they have this incredible oil and gas

28:02 resource. Do you think they give a fuck about your condescending efforts of, oh, what gives you the right? No, they want to live a better life. I wonder what they, I wonder what the sort of,

28:13 yeah, the standard of living of the 818, 000 resident, or people that lived in Guyana versus the UK The other reality here is, and Arjun Murti has pointed out several times when we're going

28:25 through this, okay, are we gonna allow or embrace more cleaner barrels production growth in places like Canada and the US, where we have defined regulations, et cetera. And we're using, I would

28:44 argue in exploration and production and we're finding and processing in midstream. some of the best technology available and trying to objectively and specifically account for the emissions footprint

29:01 of operations, you've got arguably the best operator in the world of this type of a project in Exxon out in front, maybe Chevron joins them, maybe they don't, depending on the outcome of the

29:17 arbitration on the Hesteal, but you have the most responsible operators who are acutely aware of the spotlight that's on them from

29:33 an ESG standpoint, from doing what's right from a safety and environmental standpoint. Consider that Exxon, 1989 had a global event in the form of the Valdez oil spill I guarantee you, there is a

29:48 tremendous system in place to deal with. I mean, they're out in 5, 000 feet of water. Okay. And there are currents that in the event of a spill are going to potentially impact a lot more than

30:04 just the shorelines of Guyana. So you want that, that risk management, sophisticated risk management operator in place leading the development of these resources I also think that this may have

30:19 some weird implications. You know, we talked on the show last week or the week before about the Chevron, Hess deal, and Exxon

30:31 suing them. And now, you know, it just seems like the president of Guyana has got some more political clout after this week, you know, coming up on stage like that. And so wonder what kind of

30:42 implications that might have on

30:45 bringing attention to. I'm sure it'll make the topic list. before the end of the year again. Yeah.

30:52 But I'm happy for him. Like I'm my dude, stand up for yourself, develop your country. Absolutely. Man, it seems like, you know, I don't know much about the guy outside of that. Respectful.

31:03 Respectful debate, right? You know, a couple of years ago, I was talking to one of my really good friends, Nee, and Nee is from Nigeria. And he's a really smart guy. And he's like, man, he's

31:16 like, Exxon should be getting digital walk-atters to go over to Guyana just every year, make a video, document the prosperity that this deal's gonna bring to Guyana. He's like, the only reason

31:26 that kids like me got to go to school is because of oil and gas. And so you just look at it through that lens. Great point. What it means for the people of these countries and some piece of shit,

31:39 BBC, journalists to get on there and be kind of sending like that pisses me off So anyways, I'm a big fan of this dude now. Like big fan. Let's get him on the show. hundred percent. I bet I bet

31:50 he come. He knows about digital walk-outers. He'll get in a Twitter DM like Chuck is with Andreessen. That's right. That's right. I'll find a way to get him on. Hey, speaking of what's going on

31:55 in Sweden,

32:02 Mark? Well, there's a series of pieces out since December, at least as far as I look back. But most recently, there was a commentary on Sweden's largest wind power provider

32:24 facing pretty eminent bankruptcy threat.

32:29 It's the largest wind farm in Sweden, 179 wind turbines. And it's Chinese-owned,

32:40 big dinette. They have power contracts with Pedro that run until 2040, and they're selling

32:48 every electron today at a loss. And so just to put some numbers on it, they've accumulated 220 million euros in losses in the last three years. Well, at the same time, they're their debt burden

33:01 has grown to 530 million euros. And so what's the, I guess, what's the maneuverability around this? And I want to, I want to see these things work. I, you know, I think every day when I wake

33:14 up and I see the ceiling fan turning, I don't care where the electrons come from Right. But as long as it's cheap and reliable, this kind of, this kind of leverage March can't sustain itself. And,

33:27 you know, unfortunately, the counterparty, the major counterparty in the form of HEDRO, not surprisingly, has no interest in renegotiating those contracts. No, I wouldn't. I mean, why would

33:38 you? But the problem is if they shut down what happens, what happens to HEDRO?

33:45 We're gonna source their cheat energy. Don't know what the substitutes are, the pivots, if I think Sweden's been one of the Scandinavian countries that is on the path to decommission nuclear.

33:58 Right. Well, Hydro is probably North Hydro, I'm assuming it's the Norwegian-based company that I've actually sat on a board with a Hydro company that also invested. Most of their energy is

34:13 actually Hydro It's actually waterfalls, that's interesting. Let me just see what happens. Did you just see this video I posted this morning, New York Times did this video on New York City's steam

34:26 system? No, I had, I'll be honest, steam. Yeah, the entire, the city has this entire steam system that powers the city and it's what allowed New York City to be what New York City is and have

34:40 the density I had no idea that this was. Honestly, I had no idea that this was a thing. And so, anyways, New York Times, as much as I don't like them on certain things, did this really good

34:51 video showing the steam operations and the underground. You know, you have these big steam generators and then you have pipes running all around the city and the steam, it heats things, it does

35:04 cooling. Yeah, if you ever lived in an apartment with a radiator. Yeah, I haven't. You only sit on, you only touch it once. Yeah, yeah No, I haven't. I've always been blessed to have

35:17 electric HVAC units and natural gas piped in my house. But I posted about this as a pretty fascinating video on the New York City steam system. And then one of my buddies, Duncan Campbell, he

35:29 lives up in New York City and he responded and he said, yeah, the New York District steam system sucks and it's an economic death spiral. Everyone gets off of it to make, their own, if they can,

35:40 only buildings that don't have space for a boiler, some other logistical issues stay on the system. It's quite inefficient as it doesn't return condensate and it leaks everywhere and it's super

35:49 costly to maintain. I used to work for the system and Philly, same issues. It's what inspired me to do distributed energy resources. And then he followed up with a second comment that said, Naddy

35:60 killed steam.

36:03 And so anyways, I thought the video was super interesting, but it sounds like we don't like to it. Yeah, we'll drop a link to this. We'll get Jacob to drop a link or show a clip of the video,

36:13 but also regardless of just like historic, you know, energy systems, seeing how cities were built. I mean, it's pretty cool to see. And now I actually make so much sense now, like when you see

36:26 steam coming out of the streets of New York, like I never like even I was there with my kids in December, like, why is steam coming out? Like I didn't know. That's cool. And I didn't even go

36:36 look up to see, like, why is there steam coming out? But. Anyways, go check it out. It's interesting. As to the aromatics. Dude, I've got to be - You know they did that? They had

36:48 this experiment on Fifth Avenue for Christmas, and they were pumping Christmas scent

36:54 throughout the streets, and it was like, it's like, what is that? Like cinnamon and firewood and trash and sewage. That's some scent in there, but it's natural scent. Just overpowering the weed

37:04 smell. All right, here's the deal Last weekend was Easter, so happy Easter to all those that celebrated and observed it. But it was also the Texas children's Houston Open. Yeah. Golf tournament,

37:18 professional golf tournament. And digital walk ciders had a booth. Yeah, that's a tour. Now I took my wife down to the vat. Did you go to the art tent? Well shit, dude, I got into the Texas

37:29 children's tent. I got in the United tent. I got into most tents. The one tent I could not get into because it was sold out or. too exclusive for me was digital walk-outers. Damn, you're a

37:42 podcaster, you need me to get rid of it. I'm like, I couldn't even do it. What day was this, what day was this? Friday. I mean, Friday. Friday. So, I don't know, man, I don't know if I

37:50 just got Riz, but on Saturday and Sunday, I talk to the staff and the litany bring extra people in, so. As a guy who's actually been behind the ropes of most PGA tour events, I couldn't get into

38:02 my own digital walk-outers. They're like, Sorry, bro I was like, I had to give my ticket back. I should have just given it to you. Damn, man. And now I'm looking at my own look in that. And

38:13 now I'm like, Man, I'm not gonna get into this one because I see that the countdown started to digital walk-outers crawfish boil. Yeah. And it's April 27th, no, limited to 400 people and it's

38:24 where super secret location. Like, I can see myself, I'm gonna be number 401. So show up and be like, Sorry, bro. Yeah, it's not at the Richmond House this year. It's not at the Richmond

38:35 House. I don't wear a vest. I mean, what's up, dude? I've got two. I'm trying to finance, bro. One, I'm upset that you didn't get into the DW10. I would have made that happen for sure.

38:46 They're all like throwing stuff at us, you know? But we had a, no, so let me tell you my experience because I've never watched a round of golf in my life. And be honest, I think golf's kind of

38:58 boring, but I really enjoyed my two days there, had to open. And now I'm like, I'm gonna go play golf. I'm like, that actually looks fun. Seems like a good time So maybe you take me for my

39:07 first time to play golf. We got it. Well, when you play, you'll appreciate seeing it up close. No, 100. And the first decision is unreal. I was talking to this about with the guys 'cause I'm

39:16 like, I'm watching them. I'm like, oh yeah, I can do that. And I was like, this is the equivalent. Like no one respects UFC fighters because like they have no idea how talented and technical

39:25 those guys are. It's like, and then you go with one and you're like, oh shit, like you're just lost. I was like, that's how it is for me watching professional golfers. Dude, I'm like, really?

39:33 Like no one respects like, what do you do MMA? Really? Yeah, but some interesting take, let me get some interesting takeaways from my conversations at the tents because I had people from, you

39:43 know, Exxon, SM Energy, from Precision Drilling, you know, just go down, Oxy, go down the list, and lots of interesting conversations. One,

39:55 you know, the people are talking about AI a lot, lots of excitement around that, you know, hearing how people are using Microsoft, you know, Azure AI and things of this nature had lots of

40:07 conversations between some of the service companies on automation on drilling rigs. And I think that we're, you know, if you look at the evolution of drilling rigs, when I started drilling in 2010,

40:19 that wasn't that long ago, still using Kelly rotary rigs. Like you could look at a picture of my rig in 2010. Didn't look too much different from a rig in the 30s, 40s I mean, yeah, you had a

40:32 Kelly, you had a cat head, you had a chains head. Tongues and boom all of a sudden top drives come out iron rough next with ST 80s I mean, you know hydraulic pipe arms. It's all kinds of crazy

40:45 shit and now I think what we're gonna see with the automation of drilling and then you start combining that with AI it's like It's not it's not too crazy to think that in 10 15 years, you know, we

40:59 have fully automated AI drilling rigs that that can drill and You know, take people out of the danger zones of rigs and you know allow them to monitor systems instead So and I did like your one.

41:13 It's been a few weeks ago where you said this would be much Better than the dead men line With the shoot. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, we should have Jacob pull up that video because SpaceX

41:25 posted a video of their escape shoot from Rocket launching derricks if there was a fire and Essentially you have this cable that goes down and then the shoot opens up and you slide down the shoot and

41:38 the way they've got to post that. Yeah, the way the way it works on drilling rigs is you have what's called a Geronimo line and it's a cable and you have this

41:48 steel handlebar that you hold on to or zip lining. Yeah, it's like zip lining except it's really fucking sketchy. And you have the rigs burning down. You got a, you got to get on this thing and

41:60 you, you zip down, but this shoot looked so much more safe and practical. And you know, people's questions were like, oh, is it fire resistant? I'm like, it was made for escaping a rocket

42:14 explosion on a radio. Imagine it's fire resistant. But I actually think that if someone goes and looks into that, there may be a potential business there to sell and service those things. So

42:25 that's wild. Yeah. But that's what I love too is like, if you look at like the intersection of the space industry and defense and oil and gas. and take from each of those and apply them, so.

42:39 Call it the slap shoot.

42:43 Dude, that's bad ass. That is, that's good. Let's do it. The slap shoot. We have anything else on the docket we got for four more minutes for today's show. Yeah, I had one item. I'm not gonna

42:56 mention the airline because I don't want to. We'll get to that next week. And airlines always are like, we always beat 'em down, man But this was a first, and I've probably, I estimate in my

43:06 life, I've flown north of two million miles. And long ago - Do you think yes, airline? No. United. Long ago, I - Thank you, United, for the - Stop paying rapt attention to the PA

43:21 announcements, but that's not a PSA for air passenger safety. Listen to the PA.

43:31 Chamber of Commerce Day Leave the gate. Stop on the ramp announcement is, well, this aircraft was designated for a much longer route, and instead of going back to the gate and lightering some

43:49 fluid, we're just going to sit here and burn off 2, 000 pounds of jet. And how long does that take? It took a few minutes. And so I never, I'd never, I'd never been aware of the jet just like,

44:01 yes, I'm saying they just probably happened They sit in a higher idle and just lighten the load. Just burn fuel. Yeah. So jet fuel is about seven pounds per gallon and contains about 21 pounds of

44:13 CO2 per gallon. So that's about 6, 000 pounds of CO2 flared. Damn, man.

44:21 They have flared. Right. They have to pay for that. That's already paid for. Why did they burn it off again? Lighten the load. The plan is too heavy Because you can't come in for a landing fully

44:32 fueled because it's heavy and all. like it's dangerous. So I got this, I tried to get this flight to explain this logic to me once because we had to sit out on at the gate because they had to move

44:44 baggage from the bottom, from the cargo, around to the top. And I was like, why? And like, because it's too heavy. I'm like, but the weight stays the same on the plane. It does.

44:55 The weight, just the bottom heavy. Like, trust me, I understand like the weight requirements. I mean, this is like really, like they're really particular about this on offshore helicopter

45:03 flights to offshore rigs Dude. You have to weigh yourself, you have to weigh

45:08 your bag, and then they have to shift around the load, but I was like on a plane. I was like, explained the logic, and she cut in. She's getting a little bit upset with me, but. I'll tell a

45:18 little helicopter story from my offshore days. Yeah, we got two minutes. Came in. He's got a hard start. Had to come in early on a Saturday. My rotation day was Tuesday, but came in early for

45:30 BOP school. And the field helicopter, little bell 206, they decided to shove some extra wellhead equipment. The gray hand was out there. So we put all these gray tools in the cargo and they're

45:44 pretty heavy. Yeah. If there's space, just put it in and no one cares. Yeah. The helicopter pilot said we're going to have to pick up some speed and the way we're going to do is a big platform

45:53 rig

45:54 to lay pretty high off the water. No, to take off to get airborne. So we hopped this helicopter. This was years ago So no way, hopped this helicopter to the edge of the deck and we're down in a

46:08 steep dive toward the goals and you're like, holy shit. And that, and I'm a snake of phobe and, you know, it's pretty early in the morning and helicopter pilots like to play jokes. So I'm

46:22 sitting front left side. He's on the right side and he said, what's that down there between your feet? And he'd put a plastic

46:32 snake. My heart rate was already up. And when we dove off the side, it was - People don't realize how sketchy helicopters are. Never forget it, and the pilots, dude. They don't fly. And the

46:41 pilots fly. They beat the air into submission. Yeah, but you hit a bird? Everyone's dead. You're gone. Like one bird, just some seagull. I've never seen this auto-rotate down, which is always

46:52 the belief. I've, my first helicopter flight, the guy told me. He's like, Yeah, you just float down. I'm like, Really? Hey, did you see the drone? It's got like 18 drones on it that you can

47:04 fly. It's a solo passenger. The self-machine, where you basically - I didn't say this. It's like a self-pilot, like you get in, it's a person for one and you can fly around. Oh, dope. It is

47:16 cool, but it only has an operating time, like 20 minutes, like what good is that?

47:21 Archer has like a personal. I'll have to go look at it. 'Cause I watched the video. It was pretty cool. I don't have bad ass. I want one. All right, we got it in this. 'Cause Carson's got to

47:27 get out of here, but appreciate y'all tuning in this week. As always, if you enjoy the show, please share. And if you want to get into the crawfish boil, you better sign up ASAP. Yeah, you

47:36 gotta sign up ASAP. We're gonna have a link for that soon. So hopefully. see you guys there. We will catch you next week.